Stupid boy does good

Sun Jul 06 04:33:00 -0700 2008
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I've been struggling with this one for a while, because it involves talking about my brother, and he didn't ask to get talked about, even though it isn't actually about him, just the difference between him and me.

There was a character in the TV series "Dad's Army" called "Pike", and the Bank Manager / Captain Mainwearing often looked at Pike and said "Stupid boy."

Now my brother did very well, went to uni, got his degrees, and worked his way up, this is the Accenture / PWC / City field, and he went about as far as you can go, short of breaking into the Board level, so he clearly isn't stupid, but...

... but, much to mum's chagrin, I often call him stupid, because while he went down the "management" road, I went down the "practical" road, more in line with my dad, so "stupid" in this context really means "out of touch with the practical realities", and even that doesn't mean "out of touch", per se, just the practical realities... this is complex, but important.

It comes down to the difference between casual familiarity with something, and different fields of knowledge.

This of course cuts both ways, I'd be useless in his field, and of course each of us probably feels that our own field is the significant one, he can just hire an artisan, innit...

What is most significant is this, we both came from the same place, the same environment, the same background, and he, being older, had first choice, but somewhere at university dropped engineering and went into management sciences, so the whole nurture vs nature thing looks slightly askance, we had the same nature, and we had the same nurture, hell, we even went to the same school and had many of the same teachers, and the two roads really separated at school leaving / university starting age, long after nature and nurture have done their thing.

So anyway, he comes down with a bunch of bits to convert the SWB series II Land Rover from ragtop to hard top, and while doing this we touch on my cnc mill conversion and computers and suchlike, things that to me are all just things you do, not worth mentioning, but after he has left I think about it, I didn't consult him or work WITH him in any way doing the conversion, to me it was a piddly easy job, so you just do it, "grab that", "hold that there" "go round and check those bolts are tight".

My brother isn't stupid, but I guess he got treated as stupid, by me, because he wasn't "casually competent" at things, I've turned into my dad, and he hasn't, and I don't suppose that is either good or bad, it just is.

But the point of all this.

He didn't ask me to write about him, so let's just say my brother has made good money all his working life, compared to the working man he is loaded, he is thinking about retiring and buying a country house down here and a few acres, we're talking money, he's thinking in retirement he can do a bit of consulting at 500 quid a day, and thanks to his working life to date he has the contacts and reputation to pull it off.

So yes, he will bitch about the price of filling the tank with diesel, same as you or me, but it is just bitching, he doesn't have a list of wanted toys on the refrigerator that can be acquired on the cheap now and again, if I don't fill the tank with diesel every week.

So he sees the same things as me, the economy going to hell in a handcart, but not only does he see it from a different perspective intellectually, from the management consultant point of view, he sees it different personally.

He simply doesn't have the "casually competent" skills to survive a downturn, just like 99% of my neighbours, but, on the other hand, he isn't starting from the same place.

If you pick me, one of my neighbours, and him, probably all three of us, if analysed by an accountant, have a net worth (once assets and liabilities are totted up) around zero, me because I have some assets but no liabilities, my neighbours because they have some assets and matching liabilities, and him because he has loads of assets, and loads of liabilities.

But economic downturns don't affect people like him the way they affect people like me.

I think he is fucking nuts to be considering buying a country house now, and I know the estate agent is rubbing his hands with glee, me, I'd wait 18 months for property to crash and buy at the bottom of the market, but there is the point, he isn't me.

So "stupid" takes on a new meaning, I think he is stupid to consider it, bet he... he knows he has those contacts and that reputation, and just because the proles lose their shirts, he will still find his 500 quid a day consulting gigs... the gulf between the rich and the poor.

My brother is basically middle class, dad was working class made good, me, I'm working class made something or other, not quite sure what, round peg meets square hole.

This, more than anything, is what I am seeing in society now, the progression up through working class to middle class is no longer a relatively smooth slope, there is a real gulf opening up and that first step between the two is an utter bitch.

Going up you need a rocket assist, going down you need a parachute, anything else and the "landing" will break your bones and you topple backwards into obscurity into the chasm in between the two classes.

So my brother and me, came from the same nature, came from the same nurture, but there is a big gap there now, and seeing him outside where the local working class women push their prams from the nursery past the landie where he is stood, he doesn't fit into working class any more, he ain't comfortable here.

The similarities between out outweigh the differences, and at the end of the day ("stupid boy, Pike.") he is my brother, but the differences are there, and the effect of the differences outweighs the effects of the similarities... casual competence, money, recession, none of these things mean the same thing to him as they mean to me.

Fact is, it is people like my brother who are steering the economy, not people like me, I don't know the last time, if ever, he "took care" of something or some bill for my (our) mum, not because he is callous or bad or mean, he just doesn't see money the way we do, I didn't even bother trying to tell him how much (how little) we live on, he just wouldn't get it, in the sense I might as well be jabbering away at him in Swahili.

He says to me "I can find an electrician, and a plumber, and a builder, who all went to school together, so I can just hand them a set of keys and they get on with it." and I am thinking "no wonder you get ripped off you stupid bastard." but then again, when the time taken to manage these people has to be factored against your earning capacity... it's chump change, so not so stupid, not even doesn't care, just doesn't even see that he is being ripped off, that's what things cost, whip the plastic out and 5 seconds later it is forgotten.

Different perspective.

So we've done the ragtop to hardtop conversion, he is very pleased (dunno why, trivial job) and says "anything I can do for you, let me know" and he means it, fair play to him.

So I say, quoting a line from The Boys from the Black Stuff, "gissajob" (give me a job)

My brother, bless his middle class heart, just looks at me "You don't want a job, you like doing what you're doing."

Yeah bro, I like it better than being a minimum wage monkey, but I don't like it better than doing a real job, making something, making a difference, and screw the money, but I might as well be speaking Swahili, so I smile at him and say "Yeah, beats working for a living." and Jim Morrison starts running through my head.

People are strange when you're a stranger
Faces look ugly when you're alone
Women seem wicked when you're unwanted
Streets are uneven when you're down

When you're strange
Faces come out of the rain
When you're strange
No one remembers your name
When you're strange
When you're strange
When you're strange

Stupid boy does good
Sun Jul 06 11:30:07 -0700 2008
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We've probably all seen it. I was working for this millionaire before, trying to show him a dogsquat easy plumbing job I was going to do for him, he just couldn't get it. Here's a guy who can juggle two dozen contacts in his head, while talking on two different phones, while sitting at the computer day trading, pulling off decent deals, and he just couldn't grok this pipe is going here and this is the valve and this is the....well, maybe, just didn't feel like getting it or grokking it, he was never going to have to do that so he didn't bother using his brain for that, he used his brain for other. I personally feel like that with advanced linux admin or programming, there's so many smart guys who know that stuff and have been doing it for years and I only have so many hours in a day to deal with all my other chores and projects I just don't feel like learning it, so I don't. I could start now, full time, and a year from now be at the "clueless still rank amateur" status so I don't bother. If I get stuck, I just google for a fix and follow the recipe, if it isn't there, oh well..I'll do something else.

With that said, I can see in the upcoming fun and games with the economy I just don't think I would trade my no college degree but still extensive "education" I have gotten over the years for anything else. I am not so sure even the 500 monetary units per day consulting gigs are going to be there for much longer for as many of those types who think they will always be able to get them. Specialization is perfectly all right once you have covered a very broad base of generalization as a fallback/day to day practical education. Might come a time one day the overly specialized and rich guy goes to have his "artisans" do some work for him, to have them follow his orders because he was the local fatcat, and when he goes to talk to them they all have pitchforks and torches in their hands. It's happened before in history...

Stupid boy does good
Mon Jul 07 11:39:11 -0700 2008
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You might want to talk to your brother about an investing partnership, if he has the cash.

Purchase seriously distressed homes -- foreclosed and vacant -- and YOU fix them up.  Maybe rent them out at a loss, just to offset costs.  Then, if the market rebounds in a couple years, sell them at a profit.

thanks, Charles

Mon Jul 07 18:00:48 -0700 2008
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I couldn't find good words. Guy's bro' is "funny", per this description, in a certain way that's very familiar to me. The attitude comes off, to a certain kind of recipient, as just stupidly condescending (and "the attitude" is typically without the metal to back up that condescension). And, from another more sympathetic perspective -- well, no... the attitude is kind of sane and he's also a lot of "conservative" back-up plan for a tribe of which he's a member. It's an attitude I've seen a lot, mostly not from close relatives, but I can see it in that context too. It's not bad, not good, it is what it is and I don't want to insult the third party dood here so it's hard to talk about.

But... yeah, Charles... abstracted, yrs is the right corrective to the problemitization of that attitude. Guy (per available evidence) is an example of an underexploited resource, left by the side of the road because during a boom you could get by (fake it) with lesser, cheaper talent ("we make it up in volume!"). But, if you wanna go with "Buffet-style" fundamentals investing then the Guy types are very seriously at buying price and his brother, with the inside track on that, is missing a clue. (Of course, this is all based on internet impressions of Guy. It's possible that in reality there's simply no working with him, though unlikely imo.).

-t

P.S.: So, we're (wife and I) moving. New neighborhood lacks retail. Entrepreneurial opportunities abound but aren't easy (not a cash-flush population). Little funky produce shop? Hell, produce-on-wheels? Etc.? Potential investors... on the quirk chance you see this... get in touch! (lord at emf.net).

Stupid boy does good
Thu Jul 10 07:41:32 -0700 2008
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I guess Guy's bro just goes for the important things. He has his plumbing fixed for much more than optimal, but he saves his brain power for thinking about well paid projects.

This is clever, not stupid. Factor the price of time into your calculations. Find out what is the price of your time -- how much can you earn in an hour? If there is not enough work to be done, find more, get customers.

You never get wealthy by saving only.

Stupid boy does good
Sat Aug 02 19:44:03 -0700 2008
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It's weird how much your behavior and decisions change as you make more money.  I have gone from making $8/hour to around $80/hour, and I would probably strike you similarly as your brother.  I know how to do almost everything myself, but things that made sense before (like changing my own timing belt) don't make a bit of sense when I make more money paying someone else to do it and spending my time working.  In many cases, even if someone is ripping me off (from my old perspective) I still end up ahead by using them to do work for me.


I have discovered that one of the things people making a lot of money value highly is service reliability, followed by quality.  When people with money are willing to pay more, it's almost certainly because they are paying for reliable service, not because they expect the job will be done any better (with exceptions at the very high end where only "the best" will do).

Stupid boy does good
Sun Aug 03 05:29:35 -0700 2008
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I agree with your sentiments, in principle, but to give my brother as an example, he has been so long in the situation where it was cheaper for him to pay someone to do something that he has not merely lost touch, he has forgotten much of what he once knew.

The 3 hour job that we did easily and to a high standard, he would have taken all day and done a piss poor job, lack of familiarity with doing work himself and forgetting basic principles is all it took.

Which brings you back to the question, how long do you have to make 80 bucks an hour before the person you employ at 8 bucks an hour could be good, bad, or indifferent, and you don't know the difference, thus, how do you work out earning 80 and paying 8 is actually showing you a profit?

Let me put it this way, you earn 80 bucks an hour, you spend an average of 15 minutes a day on the crapper, for a total of 1.75 hours a week, and you have sex 3 times a week for a total of 0.75 hours a week.

So you invest US$ 7,280 a year on taking a dump, and US$ 3,120 a year on screwing, just about half. Do these represent good value for money?

Stupid boy does good
Sun Aug 03 21:50:15 -0700 2008
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"<...>he has been so long in the situation where it was cheaper for him to pay someone to do something that he has not merely lost touch, he has forgotten much of what he once knew."

Yes, I'm concerned about that hapenning to me too.  I agree with you that it's not a good thing.

Also, something I have noticed is that as you point out with your example, you have to start valueing "simple" things at very high dollar amounts to keep work from consuming your life.  In my case I'm salaried (the $80 per hour is what it works out to) but if I actually billed hourly at that rate like several people I know (they actually bill double that) it gets weird. 

Priorities and decisions get even more strange when you are working on corporate projects where things you could build in your shop in a day for $1,000 take a month and $50,000 (and I'm probably underestimating there).